http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo
is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Friday, 31 March 2017 08:08:27 UTC+13, JohnO wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo
is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

Here's another one of Hager's baby killers: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11829109

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Friday, 31 March 2017 09:59:04 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the
photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "

Irrelevant diversion. Photos of the rounds are presented alongside coke bottles
with a suggestion that they are from a sniper position.

I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

Irrelevant diversion. You and your mate Hager have been well and truly found out.

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

And there we have it. The cockroaches are starting to scurry away from their original stories about NZ SAS behaving dishonourably.

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

Who and where was that?

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

Feeble. You've lost and continue to die in a ditch over it. Even the Hager friendly media are starting to walk away.

Hager's credibility, if he had any, is gone.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo

is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on

the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?


I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS
soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo

is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS >soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are >unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

Any competent journalist would not have written a book that is so
wrong. Why do you take their side?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo

is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS >soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are >unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest: http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Friday, 31 March 2017 11:06:48 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com> >wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the

photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the
photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was >found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS >soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are >unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the >villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and >injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no >Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest: http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Yes, Dickbot. The full picture and text from the book shows coke bottles and non-rifle cartridges and a suggestion that it was a sniper position.

That is the point of the comment from the Herald and myself - the book is self contradicting and appears to show a staged, i.e. fake situation.

Thanks for unwittingly supporting my point and showing up Hager's dishonesty.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 15:27:50 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Friday, 31 March 2017 11:06:48 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the

photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS
soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see
https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest:
http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Yes, Dickbot. The full picture and text from the book shows coke bottles and non-rifle cartridges and a suggestion that it was a sniper position.

The position may well be where a sniper moved up to following the
helicopter attack - can you quote what the tect of the book had to say
about it? Presumably the bottle was an indication that NZ or US
soldiers rather than local people had been present.

That is the point of the comment from the Herald and myself - the book is self

contradicting and appears to show a staged, i.e. fake situation.

What indication is there of a staged or fake situation?

Thanks for unwittingly supporting my point and showing up Hager's dishonesty. None proved. A mistake by both NZDF and Hager and Stephenson re

villages, but neither material. There are still a lot of questions
though - from the authors I would like to know whether they sought
comments from NZDF and if so what response they had - but for all I
know that may be covered in the book. From the NZDF, it would be good
to know just what did happen - I believe Wayne Mapp has a good handle
on it - he must be annoyed that he only found out some aspects from a
2014 documentary; he believes that there needs to be further enquiry
and public disclosure. Matthw Hooton also believes there needs to be
an enquiry, but I suspect that is because the issue is dragging on and
he would like to have it buried until after the election . . .

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Friday, 31 March 2017 12:26:00 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 15:27:50 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Friday, 31 March 2017 11:06:48 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849 >> >>
Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the

photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched,

shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the
photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no

expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their

lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. " >> >I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS
soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see
https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest:
http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues >> http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Yes, Dickbot. The full picture and text from the book shows coke bottles and

non-rifle cartridges and a suggestion that it was a sniper position.

The position may well be where a sniper moved up to following the
helicopter attack - can you quote what the tect of the book had to say
about it? Presumably the bottle was an indication that NZ or US
soldiers rather than local people had been present.

Right, so now you are just making up wild theories and avoiding the point. Anything to try and squirm off the hook of your own making.

And coke bottles are universal to civilians but not SAS soldiers. Obvious to most.

That is the point of the comment from the Herald and myself - the book is

self contradicting and appears to show a staged, i.e. fake situation.

What indication is there of a staged or fake situation?

Already explained. Are you being dimwitted or intentionally running away?

Thanks for unwittingly supporting my point and showing up Hager's

dishonesty.

None proved. A mistake by both NZDF and Hager and Stephenson re
villages, but neither material.

Again you run away from the point. Hagar claims to have investigated thoroughly
but gets specific, verifiable facts wrong. So his claim of fact checking thoroughness is a lie.

There are still a lot of questions
though - from the authors I would like to know whether they sought
comments from NZDF and if so what response they had

FFS you've already been told: Jim Rose OIA requested this very point, you time wasting little fuckwit.

https://groups.google.com/d/msg/nz.general/KFI9hZgLin0/gBJIW3g1FwAJ

You are as useless as Hager - even when your nose is shoved into a fact you seem to miss it.

- but for all I
know

All you know is jack shit and whatever you made up. This is now very clear.

that may be covered in the book. From the NZDF, it would be good
to know just what did happen

The HZDF held a press conference explained it. But you must have had hands over
ears while chanting "Nya nya nya" at the time.

- I believe Wayne Mapp has a good handle
on it - he must be annoyed that he only found out some aspects from a
2014 documentary; he believes that there needs to be further enquiry
and public disclosure. Matthw Hooton also believes there needs to be
an enquiry, but I suspect that is because the issue is dragging on and
he would like to have it buried until after the election . . .

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 2017-03-30, JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com> wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo
is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?


Look, Hager has a business plan, and like polticians he loves attentions.

Go.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 18:05:31 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Friday, 31 March 2017 12:26:00 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 15:27:50 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Friday, 31 March 2017 11:06:48 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849 >> >> >>
Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the

photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was >> >> >found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS >> >> >soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes, >> >> >and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were >> >> >not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see
https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest:
http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues >> >> http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Yes, Dickbot. The full picture and text from the book shows coke bottles and non-rifle cartridges and a suggestion that it was a sniper position.

The position may well be where a sniper moved up to following the
helicopter attack - can you quote what the tect of the book had to say
about it? Presumably the bottle was an indication that NZ or US
soldiers rather than local people had been present.

Right, so now you are just making up wild theories and avoiding the point. Anything to try and squirm off the hook of your own making.

And coke bottles are universal to civilians but not SAS soldiers. Obvious to most.

That is the point of the comment from the Herald and myself - the book is self contradicting and appears to show a staged, i.e. fake situation.

What indication is there of a staged or fake situation?

Already explained. Are you being dimwitted or intentionally running away?

Thanks for unwittingly supporting my point and showing up Hager's dishonesty.

None proved. A mistake by both NZDF and Hager and Stephenson re
villages, but neither material.

Again you run away from the point. Hagar claims to have investigated thoroughly but gets specific, verifiable facts wrong. So his claim of fact checking thoroughness is a lie.

There are still a lot of questions
though - from the authors I would like to know whether they sought
comments from NZDF and if so what response they had

FFS you've already been told: Jim Rose OIA requested this very point, you time

wasting little fuckwit.

https://groups.google.com/d/msg/nz.general/KFI9hZgLin0/gBJIW3g1FwAJ

You are as useless as Hager - even when your nose is shoved into a fact you seem to miss it.

- but for all I
know

All you know is jack shit and whatever you made up. This is now very clear.

that may be covered in the book. From the NZDF, it would be good
to know just what did happen

The HZDF held a press conference explained it. But you must have had hands over ears while chanting "Nya nya nya" at the time.

- I believe Wayne Mapp has a good handle
on it - he must be annoyed that he only found out some aspects from a
2014 documentary; he believes that there needs to be further enquiry
and public disclosure. Matthw Hooton also believes there needs to be
an enquiry, but I suspect that is because the issue is dragging on and
he would like to have it buried until after the election . . .

Apart from being abusive, you have provided no content other than
assertions than all is well, but you do not comment on the reality
that even within National and its supporters people are still calling
for investigation and answers to questyions raised. With Wayne Mapp,
Matthew Hooton and even "Chemical Mike" Hosking all saying further investigation and answers are needed. why are you out of step?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31 Mar 2017 05:48:41 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2017-03-30, JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com> wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the

photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

Look, Hager has a business plan, and like polticians he loves attentions.

Go.

And Hager and Stephenson continue to get that attention: http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/201838494/security-analyst-paul-buchanan-sifts-through-hit-and-run-claims

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31/03/2017 9:59 a.m., Rich80105 wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the

photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

A competent reporter wouldn't have published a book without getting
comment from NZDef Rich. The book is an attempt by Hager and Stephenson
to revenge themselves on NZDef for perceived attacks on them by Defence. They're like you Rich. Victims of their own stupidity!

Pooh

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31/03/2017 11:07 a.m., Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the
photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was
found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS
soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes,
and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were
not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Strange looking drink bottles? You are an ignorant bloody troll Rich!
They can be seen on any supermarket shelf anywhere in the world ffs! NOT
SAS drink bottles which would have been army issue!

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest: http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Neither of these links are of any use except to support the bullshit
currently being flung into the wind by you, Hager and Stephenson!

Pooh

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31/03/2017 12:26 p.m., Rich80105 wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 15:27:50 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Friday, 31 March 2017 11:06:48 UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 09:59:26 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Mar 2017 12:08:26 -0700 (PDT), JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com>
wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849 >>>>>
Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the

photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

I wonder if the Herald reporter had read the book.
See
https://www.hitandrunnz.com/photos/

and there is a photo of similar cartridges with the caption "Empty
shell casings were scattered throughout the villages, each stamped
‘30MM HEDP M789’: Apache helicopter high explosive cannon rounds. "
I don't think Stephenson was at all confused about what ammunition was >>>> found. He has said, and I don't think it has been refuted, that NZ SAS >>>> soldiers called in and guided the helcopters where to shoot. They are
unlikely to have been standing where Apache shells landed . . .

But the article from The Herald goes further and quotes Dunne saying:
" "What if the Defence Force's rebuttal is correct as far as it goes, >>>> and the SAS was not involved in the attacks, and the video footage
also confirms that, but shows that another force, the Americans, were
more explicitly involved than has been indicated to date.

"Does New Zealand want to be the source of exposing that right now,
given the unpredictability of the current administration?" Dunne
asks." "

So here we have a supporter of National claiming that NZ soldiers were >>>> not even invovled in the operation - the story gets more and more
bizarre!

The Herald also seem to be a bit behind developments. They said:
"Hit & Run claimed the SAS carried out a raid in August 2010 on the
villages of Naik and Khak Khuday Dad, which killed six civilians and
injured 15.

The NZDF said the NZSAS had never operated in those villages but
instead carried out a raid on nearby Tirgiran Village 2km away."

Any competent reporter would have already picked up that there is no
Tirgiran Village - the Defence got that wrong.

And we are not the only people looking at that Herald article and
wondering. I do not have the book, but one person took the time to
actually look at the page: see
https://twitter.com/Suzyiam/status/847526750523334656

The picture refers to strange looking drink bottles, and refers to
Apache high expolsive cannon rounds - see the exceprt in the comments
below the photo.

Sometimes incompetent sycophantic support is not the support the
government needs . . .

Other links of interest:
http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/operation-burnham-the-cover-up-continues >>> http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11827986

Yes, Dickbot. The full picture and text from the book shows coke bottles and

non-rifle cartridges and a suggestion that it was a sniper position.

The position may well be where a sniper moved up to following the
helicopter attack - can you quote what the tect of the book had to say
about it? Presumably the bottle was an indication that NZ or US
soldiers rather than local people had been present.

That is the point of the comment from the Herald and myself - the book is self contradicting and appears to show a staged, i.e. fake situation.

What indication is there of a staged or fake situation?

The book claims the items were picked up in the area the troops came
from Rich. They were GATHERED you lying trolling marxist muppet!

Thanks for unwittingly supporting my point and showing up Hager's dishonesty.

None proved. A mistake by both NZDF and Hager and Stephenson re
villages, but neither material. There are still a lot of questions
though - from the authors I would like to know whether they sought
comments from NZDF and if so what response they had - but for all I
know that may be covered in the book. From the NZDF, it would be good
to know just what did happen - I believe Wayne Mapp has a good handle
on it - he must be annoyed that he only found out some aspects from a
2014 documentary; he believes that there needs to be further enquiry
and public disclosure. Matthw Hooton also believes there needs to be
an enquiry, but I suspect that is because the issue is dragging on and
he would like to have it buried until after the election . . .

WRONG! The mistakes were Hager and Stephenson who btw have NEVER been
within about 115km of any of the villages! Hager and Stephenson are
relying on information from unnamed sources. It's the sort of
information you've attacked posters in this ng for using yet your quite
happy when your traitorous gods do it! You Rich are just a trolling,
marxist liar! Just like Hager and Stephenson. Why anybody bothers
letting you continue to pollute this ng with your lies and one eyed
marxist beliefs is beyond me.

Pooh

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31/03/2017 8:08 a.m., JohnO wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo

are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the photo
is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert

analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?




What do you mean 'Another hole in Hager's story'? JohnO. I'm still
looking for any facts in his fairy tale. Hell the reason Rich is backing
him up so vociferously is they're fellow trolls, marxist muppets and liars!

Pooh

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)

On 31/03/2017 7:54 p.m., Rich80105 wrote:

On 31 Mar 2017 05:48:41 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2017-03-30, JohnO <johno1234@gmail.com> wrote:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11828849

Anyone who has any firearms knowledge would know the cartridges in the photo are *obviously* not sniper ammunition, which looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NATO_7.62x51.jpg

So much for Hager doing any fact checking.

But this is more disturbing than a simple case of poorly researched, shoddy

work by Hager. Experts suggest the ammunition in the photo came from a helicopter's weapon. If this was the case, it wouldn't be clustered together. The authors claim the
photo is from a sniper position, as shown by the clustered ammunition and the drink bottles. But if this is helicopter ammunition it would be spread over a wide area and be further away from the target and there wouldn't be drink bottles dropped around
it.

The obvious answer is that the photo is staged.

So we have on one hand, shoddy, poorly researched material, with no expert analysis before rushing it to print. And on the other hand, we have the appearance of staged, fake evidence.

And we're expected to believe his story ahead of people who put their lives

on the line to protect and represent us and other innocents?

Look, Hager has a business plan, and like polticians he loves attentions.

Go.

And Hager and Stephenson continue to get that attention: http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/201838494/security-analyst-paul-buchanan-sifts-through-hit-and-run-claims

RadioNZ is hardly an unbiased source of information unless you're as
desperate as Rich to try and reclaim his total lack of believability.
The sooner the government stops funding at leaves it to work for a
living the better!

Pooh

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: Agency HUB, Dunedin - New Zealand | Fido<>Usenet Gateway (3:770/3)