• A thought fo Christmas

    From Rich80105@3:770/3 to All on Friday, December 23, 2016 08:54:29
    http://briefingpapers.co.nz/2016/12/and-so-this-is-christmas/

    There is a good paper on media ownership on that site as well

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  • From Gordon@3:770/3 to rich80105@hotmail.com on Friday, December 23, 2016 02:58:43
    On 2016-12-22, Rich80105 <rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
    http://briefingpapers.co.nz/2016/12/and-so-this-is-christmas/

    There is a good paper on media ownership on that site as well

    Jolly good show.

    Where isPatrick Fitgerald? for this is the kind of headline he
    would post.

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  • From Crash@3:770/3 to All on Friday, December 23, 2016 17:00:41
    On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 08:54:29 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    http://briefingpapers.co.nz/2016/12/and-so-this-is-christmas/

    [snip]

    That is indeed an interesting article. However there is another
    'elephant in the room' that the author does not tackle. That is that
    the reforms introduced by the Labour Government in 1938 to provide taxpayer-funded social support created an expectation that those who
    suffer financial reversals such as job losses no longer need to look
    after themselves because the state will provide financial support.

    In 1938 the world was emerging from the worst financial meltdown in
    living memory and charities struggled to cope (as they do today) and
    this was the back story to these reforms.

    One of the emerging trends that has not yet got much media attention
    is that charities such as the various City Missions and Salvation Army
    etc. are much more efficient at distributing charity to those that
    actually need the help, than civil servants. This is in part because
    all funding comes from voluntary sources and their work is carried out
    in a large part by dedicated and selfless volunteers.

    The question is not why the Welfare State has degenerated to the point
    that charities are needed to fill the gaps of need, but how do we
    increase the voluntary financial contributions to charities.
    Fundamentally we must acknowledge the Welfare State is not a universal
    panacea to supporting those in need, and that those of us who can
    should support charities more as an alternative to increased
    government spending to achieve the same result.


    --
    Crash McBash

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  • From Rich80105@3:770/3 to All on Friday, December 23, 2016 20:02:32
    On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 17:00:41 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid>
    wrote:

    On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 08:54:29 +1300, Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    http://briefingpapers.co.nz/2016/12/and-so-this-is-christmas/

    [snip]

    That is indeed an interesting article. However there is another
    'elephant in the room' that the author does not tackle. That is that
    the reforms introduced by the Labour Government in 1938 to provide >taxpayer-funded social support created an expectation that those who
    suffer financial reversals such as job losses no longer need to look
    after themselves because the state will provide financial support.

    I dont think that was ever true - at various times there have been
    government projects deliberately designed to provide employment to
    those out of work, and training programmes for those whose industry
    had declined or disappeared. Of course there have always been people
    disabled through work and other accidents who may never be able to
    work again, but the aim has usually been to enable where necessary
    gainful employment wherever possible - regardless of the government of
    the day.


    In 1938 the world was emerging from the worst financial meltdown in
    living memory and charities struggled to cope (as they do today) and
    this was the back story to these reforms.

    World governments are better at avoiding the extremes of the 1930's
    depression, but for individuals the effect can be the same. You are
    right that charities are struggling to cope - the article above refers
    to a significant increase in the last year. We may not have had a
    general financial meltdown, but the meltdown has had a similar effect
    on a lot of individual families.


    One of the emerging trends that has not yet got much media attention
    is that charities such as the various City Missions and Salvation Army
    etc. are much more efficient at distributing charity to those that
    actually need the help, than civil servants. This is in part because
    all funding comes from voluntary sources and their work is carried out
    in a large part by dedicated and selfless volunteers.

    No, charities are struggling. They do not have the ability to detect
    false claimants to the extent that the government has - I know that in
    my area they share information between charities, but it does not
    extend very far. They do ask more questions thaan they used to, and
    they have become very good at helping people make sure that they have
    claimed all they are entitled to from government agencies, and some
    provide budgetting assistance - but these are replacing "services"
    that used to be part of the government system. They are volunteers,
    and charities are very aware that they are not able to reach all those
    in need, and that people in different areas will receive different
    levels of assistance, based not only on need but also on the demand in
    a local area. As the article points out, the priority for government
    has changed from providing benefits to those qualifying through need
    to reducing overall cost. The changes now have the effect of resulting
    in children in different areas having different levels of opportunity
    than those in other areas - equality of oportunity used to be a goal
    of governments in times past. As regards the elderly or disabled,
    there are similar differences - those in areas where rents for example
    have increased sharply, we get much higher death rates in winter as
    people are finding they cannot afford heating - churches in particular
    are aware of the deprivation of the elderly.


    The question is not why the Welfare State has degenerated to the point
    that charities are needed to fill the gaps of need,
    That seems a legitimate question to me - what do you think is the
    answer?

    but how do we
    increase the voluntary financial contributions to charities.
    Two sets of earthquakes have already made a huge call on people's
    capacity for charitable donations, and more is already being given to
    charities for simple poverty as discussed above than ever before, but
    with many families having had no increase in real disposable income
    for over 5 years, it is not surprising that charities are finding they
    are unable to meet the needs they are faced with. New Zealanders are
    generous, but at some stage we look to government to provide
    consistent advice up to a minimum level - in a sense a decision by
    governmetn to fund charities (which they do quite a bit), is a
    voluntary decision on our behalf by the politicians - if they are not representing our wishes (by either providing more or less than we
    collectively want) then over time we will get what we collectively
    want.

    Fundamentally we must acknowledge the Welfare State is not a universal >panacea to supporting those in need, and that those of us who can
    should support charities more as an alternative to increased
    government spending to achieve the same result.

    I don't think many people would disagree - but there is not universal
    agreement on the level at which the welfare state should intervene.
    Personally I believe that the old objectives of equal opportunity
    should still be valid - that calls for a level of income sufficient to
    provide a standard of living that avoids illnesses and deaths from
    poverty, lack of heating, and over-crowding. Sadly too many New
    Zealanders still experience those problems.

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  • From Fred@3:770/3 to Gordon on Saturday, December 24, 2016 15:19:29
    This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
    On 23/12/2016 03:58 PM, Gordon wrote:
    On 2016-12-22, Rich80105 <rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
    http://briefingpapers.co.nz/2016/12/and-so-this-is-christmas/

    There is a good paper on media ownership on that site as well

    Jolly good show.

    Where isPatrick Fitgerald? for this is the kind of headline he
    would post.


    Is he still alive? Been gone a long time from this site.

    bnVsbA==

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