On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot >>>>>>>> net dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal
cannabis opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for >>>>>>>>> working folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your >>>>>>>>> party is as much to blame as the current government! So please >>>>>>>>> respect a fighter and let her rest in peace and let her family >>>>>>>>> say their good byes!

Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an >>>>>>>> issue comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - >>>>>>>> or something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would >>>>>>>> expect one party to support and another to oppose, but if they >>>>>>>> are in power at the approriate time, the party that would have >>>>>>>> been expected to oppose may find that they cannot ignore public >>>>>>>> opinion and pass legislation. This is an issue that could easily >>>>>>>> have been one of those - if the libertarian, business oriented >>>>>>>> part of National had not been overruled by the conservative,
moralistic, simplistic part. We do have many drugs that are
rightly prescription only - but this drug started as a
recreational drug used by people that would not normally be
assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of issues >>>>>>>> is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>> is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found acceptable >>>>>>>> in a number of other countries; public opinion would support it, >>>>>>>> but despite yur views, it is effectively a political decision - >>>>>>>> which in this case appears to be being made or strongly
influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other
undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same
issues have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the
difference that public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not >>>>>>>> have the evidence of both the beneficial effect of medicinal
cannabis, or the expereince of other countries. Again the reasons >>>>>>>> for policy not being changed were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that >>>>>>>> she did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue >>>>>>>> does not die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from >>>>>>>> things because they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life >>>>>>>> trying to help others, and that is how she will be remembered. >>>>>>>> Peter Dunne and some others that have their heads in the sand on >>>>>>>> this issue will not be as well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just
can't help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys They were an English trade union >>family and professed communists until that became unpopular with the hoi >>polloi whence they joined liebor Remember how every school holiday the >>Cooks and Stewards Union or the Seamans Union would be on strike and tie
up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much to blame
for that not coming through as National and that therefore he was not
making a political statement!. There have of course now been quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of medicinal
cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just today we hear
of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow the use of
medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the timing was
not political, but it did need a decision from a politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long, but there
it is.

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has recently
died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example National
fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of rational
argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith Collins does
you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working >>>>>>>>> folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a fighter >>>>>>>>> and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or
something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of >>>>>>>> issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal
cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other
undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence of >>>>>>>> both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until
that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor
Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the
Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!. There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example
National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>> dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working >>>>>>>>>> folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a fighter >>>>>>>>>> and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or >>>>>>>>> something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>>>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of >>>>>>>>> issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal >>>>>>>>> cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other >>>>>>>>> undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence of >>>>>>>>> both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>>>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>>>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>>>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until
that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor
Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the
Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely
respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National

No I didn't "try" to say it, I actually succeed in saying it!

and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!.

Non sequitur! It was not political you scrote (no such word as scroat!)

There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new.

Absolute lie, it has been around internationally and here for a couple of decades. why do you imitate Mr. Trump and make stuff up?

It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Why don't you ask Ms. Clark?

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example
National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins

What on Earth does that mean, a bit early for the gin bottle is it not?

does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

Here is the schoolmarm back, oh dear George, go and stand in the corner!!!!

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working >>>>>>>>> folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a fighter >>>>>>>>> and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or
something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of >>>>>>>> issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal
cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other
undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence of >>>>>>>> both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until
that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor >>Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the >>Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely >respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!. There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example
National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working folk. >> By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as much to blame as the
current government! So please respect a fighter and let her rest in peace and
let her family say their good byes!

Agreed Tony. Much as I almost totally disagreed with her political
beliefs I have the utmost respect for her devotion to what she
believed in. It is possible to oppose a viewpoint but respect the
motives and beliefs of opponents.

My admiration is for her advocacy for medicinal use of marijuana and
her advocacy for those with terminal illness to make life-ending free choices. While I am not a victim of ill-health as she was I hope that
the medicinal reforms she sought come to fruition.

--
Crash McBash

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working folk.
By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as much to blame

the
current government! So please respect a fighter and let her rest in peace
and
let her family say their good byes!

Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or
something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to
oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass
legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of those >>>>> - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had not been >>>>> overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. We do have >>>>> many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this drug started >>>>> as a recreational drug used by people that would not normally be
assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of issues is
difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal cannabis is a
positive oportunity. It has been tried and found acceptable in a
number of other countries; public opinion would support it, but
despite yur views, it is effectively a political decision - which in >>>>> this case appears to be being made or strongly influenced by Peter
Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other undesirable drugs in the
past. I accept that many of the same issues have existed in teh past >>>>> under Labour, but with the difference that public opinion was lessin >>>>> favour, and we did not have the evidence of both the beneficial effect >>>>> of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince of other countries. Again the >>>>> reasons for policy not being changed were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many
things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she
did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help
others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political assertions
even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an irritant, >> like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting!
Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't
help it, can you Tony?

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>> dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot

dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for

folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a

and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or >>>>>>>> something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would

one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation

issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal >>>>>>>> cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other >>>>>>>> undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence

both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does

die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things

they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be

well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until >>that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor >>Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the >>Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is >>the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely >respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!. There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of >medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the >timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example >National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

Nope she was a left wing Labor party lackey who agitated for people to
go on strike at the drop of a hat.. Color it how you like Rich but
that's the truth..

Kelly tried her very hardest to sabotage the making of Peter Jackson's Hobbit

The worst thing was the actors wanted the union to butt out!

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working >>>>>>>>> folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a fighter >>>>>>>>> and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or
something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of >>>>>>>> issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal
cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other
undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence of >>>>>>>> both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until
that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor
Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the
Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!. There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

On 10/14/2016 6:40 PM, Tony wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis
opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working
folk.
By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as much to
blame as the
current government! So please respect a fighter and let her rest in
peace and
let her family say their good byes!

Tony

Yup.
Two points.
We have medical cannabis available and becoming freer but what's the
next 'alternative' going to be?

When are the unions going to hold a memorial strike on the ferries?
Just missed one school holiday so no doubt the Cooks and Stewards and
Seamens Unions are all ready to go over christmas..

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>> dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal cannabis >>>>>>>>>> opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for working >>>>>>>>>> folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a fighter >>>>>>>>>> and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good byes! >>>>>>>>>>
Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an issue >>>>>>>>> comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or >>>>>>>>> something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would expect >>>>>>>>> one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in power >>>>>>>>> at the approriate time, the party that would have been expected to >>>>>>>>> oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National had >>>>>>>>> not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic part. >>>>>>>>> We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but this >>>>>>>>> drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary separation of >>>>>>>>> issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal >>>>>>>>> cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or strongly >>>>>>>>> influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other >>>>>>>>> undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same issues >>>>>>>>> have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference that >>>>>>>>> public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the evidence of >>>>>>>>> both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the expereince >>>>>>>>> of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being changed >>>>>>>>> were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt that she >>>>>>>>> did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue does not >>>>>>>>> die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things because >>>>>>>>> they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne and some >>>>>>>>> others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will not be as >>>>>>>>> well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an
irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just can't >>>>> help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until
that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor
Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the
Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is
the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely
respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!. There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new. It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example
National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

Nope she was a left wing Labor party lackey who agitated for people to
go on strike at the drop of a hat.. Color it how you like Rich but
that's the truth..

On 10/16/2016 3:24 PM, Tony wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 16 Oct 2016 09:44:24 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/15/2016 11:20 PM, HitAnyKey wrote:

On Sat, 15 Oct 2016 22:55:45 +1300, Rich80105 wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 23:23:04 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net >>>>>> dot nz> wrote:

Gordon <Gordon@clear.net.nz> wrote:

On 2016-10-14, Tony <lizandtony> wrote:

Rich80105<rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 00:40:19 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon >>>>>>>>>> dot net
dot nz> wrote:

She and many others should have been allowed the medicinal >>>>>>>>>>> cannabis
opportunity.
She fought for her beliefs and was a determined advocate for >>>>>>>>>>> working
folk. By the way Rich - this is non-political - your party is as >>>>>>>>>>> much to blame as the current government! So please respect a >>>>>>>>>>> fighter
and let her rest in peace and let her family say their good >>>>>>>>>>> byes!

Tony

You have a very jaundiced view of politics, Tony. Sometimes an >>>>>>>>>> issue
comes to the fore that strikes our collective conscience - or >>>>>>>>>> something like that. There are sometimes issues that you would >>>>>>>>>> expect
one party to support and another to oppose, but if they are in >>>>>>>>>> power
at the approriate time, the party that would have been
expected to
oppose may find that they cannot ignore public opinion and pass >>>>>>>>>> legislation. This is an issue that could easily have been one of >>>>>>>>>> those - if the libertarian, business oriented part of National >>>>>>>>>> had
not been overruled by the conservative, moralistic, simplistic >>>>>>>>>> part.
We do have many drugs that are rightly prescription only - but >>>>>>>>>> this
drug started as a recreational drug used by people that would not >>>>>>>>>> normally be assocaited with National, and the necessary
separation of
issues is difficult for some. I agree with you that medicinal >>>>>>>>>> cannabis is a positive oportunity. It has been tried and found >>>>>>>>>> acceptable in a number of other countries; public opinion would >>>>>>>>>> support it, but despite yur views, it is effectively a political >>>>>>>>>> decision - which in this case appears to be being made or
strongly
influenced by Peter Dunne - who bizarrely has supported other >>>>>>>>>> undesirable drugs in the past. I accept that many of the same >>>>>>>>>> issues
have existed in teh past under Labour, but with the difference >>>>>>>>>> that
public opinion was lessin favour, and we did not have the
evidence of
both the beneficial effect of medicinal cannabis, or the
expereince
of other countries. Again the reasons for policy not being >>>>>>>>>> changed
were totally political.

I suspect her family is proud of the stance that she took on many >>>>>>>>>> things - not just medicinal cannabis; it is not her fauilt >>>>>>>>>> that she
did not succeed in this campaign; let us hope that the issue >>>>>>>>>> does not
die. We have lost a fighter who did not shy away from things >>>>>>>>>> because
they may be deemed "political"- she spent her life trying to help >>>>>>>>>> others, and that is how she will be remembered. Peter Dunne >>>>>>>>>> and some
others that have their heads in the sand on this issue will >>>>>>>>>> not be as
well remembered.

You are "full of it", you cannot step aside from snide political >>>>>>>>> assertions even under these circumstances can you?
I have no jaundice; you have no integrity.

It would have been better if you had not replied.

That is a reasonable opinion but only that - an opinion! He is an >>>>>>> irritant,
like a mosquito on the bum of humanity. Sometimes he needs swatting! >>>>>>> Tony

There you go introducing your political mantras again - you just
can't
help it, can you Tony?

That's weak, even for you.

The left are in denial about the Kellys
They were an English trade union family and professed communists until >>>> that became unpopular with the hoi polloi whence they joined liebor
Remember how every school holiday the Cooks and Stewards Union or the
Seamans Union would be on strike and tie up the ferries.
rich is perpetuating (or attempting to) the political dinosaur that is >>>> the rabid left

What a nasty little scroat you can be george. Helen Kelly was a widely
respected New Zealander, who as Tony said was a determined advocate
for working folk. In saying that she should have won one of her most
recent political battles. Tony tried to say that Labour were as much
to blame for that not coming through as National

No I didn't "try" to say it, I actually succeed in saying it!

and that therefore he
was not making a political statement!.

Non sequitur! It was not political you scrote (no such word as scroat!)

There have of course now been
quite a few years since Labour were in government, but the issue of
medicinal cannabis is in fact relatively new.

Absolute lie, it has been around internationally and here for a couple of
decades. why do you imitate Mr. Trump and make stuff up?

It is ironic that just
today we hear of a second case where Peter Dunne has agreed to allow
the use of medicianal canaabis in a second case - we can hope that the
timing was not political, but it did need a decision from a
politician.

Given the experience of other countries, and the principles of
individual freedom that National purports to follow why they have
fought against controlled prescription use of cannabis for so long,
but there it is.

Why don't you ask Ms. Clark?

Your attempted slur against a New Zealand born person that has
recently died is despicable, and yet another instance of the example
National fosters of making do with personal attacks when bereft of
rational argument. Following Tony in channelling your inner Judith
Collins

What on Earth does that mean, a bit early for the gin bottle is it not?

does you and discussion in nz.general no good at all, george.

Here is the schoolmarm back, oh dear George, go and stand in the
corner!!!!

The trouble with the left is they have no use for truth of any kind
Notice in his rant he doesn't and cannot disprove my statements
We used to ferry people across the Straits every school holiday

On 10/20/2016 11:20 AM, JohnO wrote:

Kelly tried her very hardest to sabotage the making of Peter Jackson's Hobbit films in NZ, putting at risk the massive tourism bonanza those films have triggered. Was not classy when she called Sir Peter a "spoiled brat" either.

The worst thing was the actors wanted the union to butt out!

There were so many examples of the families destructive behavior through
the union movement in the 60's and onward.
NZ Truth had a least one headline a month concerned with the union
movements arrogance and ignorance.
Ben and I used to bet on it

On Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:40:16 +1300, george152 <gblack@hnpl.net> wrote:

On 10/20/2016 11:20 AM, JohnO wrote:

Kelly tried her very hardest to sabotage the making of Peter Jackson's Hobbit films in NZ, putting at risk the massive tourism bonanza those films have triggered. Was not classy when she called Sir Peter a "spoiled brat" either.

The worst thing was the actors wanted the union to butt out!

There were so many examples of the families destructive behavior through
the union movement in the 60's and onward.
NZ Truth had a least one headline a month concerned with the union
movements arrogance and ignorance.
Ben and I used to bet on it

For a differerent viewpoint: http://www.colinjames.co.nz/2016/10/18/dribble-politics-quenching-policy-hotspots/
* One who didn’t do dribble politics died on Friday. Helen Kelly
developed innovative union responses to difficult changes in
political, social and workplace conditions. Peters got it right when
he said she had earned a place in “our national story”.""

(for context you need to read the article)