• Re: How Buddhist Cultural Memes Were Appropriated By Christianity

    From Dr. Jai Maharaj@1:229/2 to All on Monday, August 05, 2019 21:10:50
    XPost: soc.culture.indian, alt.fan.jai-maharaj, alt.politics
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, rec.sport.cricket, uk.sport.cricket
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    From: alt.fan.jai-maharaj@googlegroups.com

    In article <hjBWE.59525$vU3.22099@fx37.iad>,
    FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATe...@yahoo.com> posted:

    How Buddhist Cultural Memes Were Appropriated By Christianity

    What else is new?

    Jesus was a Buddhist Monk BBC Documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbZCfWZI6qE

    Govt of India Documentary on Jesus in Kashmir !! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9w-xJfSOyc

    A western christian herself FINALLY got enlightened and
    realized "Christianity" is NOTHING but SNAKE OIL.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5gARFv4wrk

    =========================================================

    https://swarajyamag.com/culture/how-buddhist-cultural-memes-were-appropriated-by-christianity

    How Buddhist Cultural Memes Were Appropriated By
    Christianity

    by Subhash Kak
    Feb 06, 2016, 2:36 pm

    What is the exact relationship between the New Testament
    and ancient Indian texts on Buddhism? How much of the early
    gospels were inspired by the Buddhist texts?

    Living in the global village as we do, it is good to trace
    the origins of iconic stories within the palimpsest of
    culture, especially those that hold power over the
    religious imagination of people and have the potential to
    create discord, in order we can all celebrate our shared
    heritage and look at each other in friendship. More often
    than not it will reveal the tangled nature of our
    collective memories.

    We know that the Panchatantra stories traveled west from
    India and became Kalilah wa-Dimnah in Arabic (after the
    names of the two jackals Karataka and Damanaka). The name
    of the influential philosophical movement of Brethren of
    Purity (ikhwan al-safa) is itself traced to one of the
    Panchatantra stories. These stories and others from the
    katha-sarita-sagara were celebrated in the Arabian Nights
    and Sindbad. Scholars have also noted parallels between the
    Panchatantra and Aesop's fables.

    The origin of the legend of Barlaam and Josaphat, two of
    the most famous Christian saints of the Middle Ages is less
    widely known. This legend was so hugely popular that, from
    time to time, the Church announced that the relics of the
    two had appeared miraculously and were then installed with
    solemn ceremony. Barlaam and Josaphat found their way into
    the Roman Martyrology (27 November), and into the Greek
    calendar (26 August).

    The legend tells how an Indian king persecutes his son,
    Josaphat, who astrologers have foretold, will establish the
    Christian Church. In due course, Josaphat meets the hermit
    Saint Barlaam and converts to Christianity. In the end, the
    prince's father accepts the son's conversion and retires to
    the desert to spend his last days with the old teacher.

    Church scholars now acknowledge that Barlaam and Josaphat
    is a play on the names Bhagavan and Bodhisattva, and it is
    a reworking of the story of Buddha's enlightenment. The
    original story was a Mahayana text that was translated into
    Arabic and European languages. Indeed, this legend should
    not startle us for St. Ann, St. Lucy, St. Denis and St.
    Brigid, represent pre-Christian deities Anna, Lucia,
    Dionysus and Brighid were similarly assimilated.

    The echo of Indian stories in the early gospels and the
    influence of Vedanta and Buddhism on Gnosticism is also
    well accepted. In particular, the non-canonical Gospel of
    Thomas (which was discovered at Nag Hammadi in 1945)
    resonates with Indian ideas of spirituality.

    The question of the possible relationship between the New
    Testament and Indian texts has a long history. The great
    philosopher Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860) went so far as
    to suggest that the canonical gospels had an Indian basis:

    The New Testament � must be in some way traceable to an
    Indian source: its ethical system, its ascetic view of
    morality, its pessimism, and its Avatar, are all thoroughly
    Indian. It is its morality which places it in a position of
    such emphatic and essential antagonism to the Old Testament
    so that the story of the Fall is the only possible point of
    connection between the two.

    The famed Indologist Max M�ller also spoke of the
    connections:

    That there are startling coincidences between Buddhism and
    Christianity cannot be denied, and it must likewise be
    admitted that Buddhism existed at least 400 years before
    Christianity. I go even further, and should feel extremely
    grateful if anybody would point out to me the historical
    channels through which Buddhism had influenced early
    Christianity.

    This challenge was met by Rudolf Seydel, who showed that
    the originals of the events in the gospels are in the
    Lalitavistara Sutra, and he listed fifty-one parallels.
    Some of these are virginal conception by Mary and Maya, the
    annunciation by the angels, the star in the east, the tree
    that bends down to aid the mother, and the old sage who
    predicts the child's future.

    Further specific parallels are in Luke's infancy narrative,
    in the story of the good thief, the story of the temptation
    of Jesus, the prediction of his death as in John 12.34, or
    the story of the aged Simeon in Luke 2:25 (the Buddhist
    Asita), or the passage John 7:38. Some see the parallels as
    no more than coincidences, although their details appear to
    go against that view. The scholar Albert J. Edmunds tried
    to find middle ground thus:

    Each religion is independent in the main, but the younger
    one arose in such a hotbed of eclecticism that it probably
    borrowed a few legends and ideas from the older, which was
    quite accessible to it.

    It is hard to take the view that the Buddhist texts
    borrowed from the Christian gospels since the life stories
    of the Buddha were translated into Chinese from Sanskrit as
    early as the eleventh year of the reign of Emperor Ming of
    the Eastern Han Dynasty (69 CE), and this is much prior to
    the time the gospels were written down.

    Another important perspective is the operation of the
    Church and the Buddhist temple. Our evidence comes from the
    French Lazarist missionaries, Evariste Huc, and Joseph
    Gabet, who were amongst the first Westerners to visit Lhasa
    in the 1840s. Their travels through Asia and Tibet were
    chronicled in Huc's book Souvenirs d'un voyage dans la
    Tartarie, le Thibet et la Chine pendant les ann�es 1844,
    1845 et 1846. Huc was astonished by the similarities
    between Buddhist and Catholic rituals:

    The cross, the miter, the dalmatica, the cope, � , the
    service with double choirs, the psalmody, the exorcisms,
    the censer at suspended from five chains, the benedictions
    given by the Lamas by extending the right hand over the
    heads of the faithful, the chaplet, ecclesiastical
    celibacy, spiritual retirement, the worship of the saints,
    the fasts, the processions, the litanies, the holy water,
    all these are analogies between the Buddhists and
    ourselves.

    Huc explained the similarities in the borrowings by the
    Tibetans from the West. But Tibetan Buddhism has an old
    history that connects it to the Buddhist monasteries of
    China and India with ancient prescriptions of ritual and
    worship, and it is implausible it borrowed the practices of
    a remote creed. It is more likely that the Tibetan and the
    Catholic rituals have a common source.

    Dhanyavaad for posting the article.

    Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi Om Shanti http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.jai-maharaj

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From Steve Hayes@1:229/2 to Dr. Jai Maharaj on Tuesday, August 06, 2019 07:45:03
    XPost: soc.history.alt.religion.buddhism, alt.religion.christianity, alt.religion
    From: hayesstw@telkomsa.net

    On Mon, 05 Aug 2019 21:10:50 GMT, alt.fan.jai-maharaj@googlegroups.com
    (Dr. Jai Maharaj) wrote:

    That there are startling coincidences between Buddhism and
    Christianity cannot be denied, and it must likewise be
    admitted that Buddhism existed at least 400 years before
    Christianity. I go even further, and should feel extremely
    grateful if anybody would point out to me the historical
    channels through which Buddhism had influenced early
    Christianity.

    There are indeed similarities between Buddhism and Christianity,
    though they tend to be superficial.

    As you get closer to the centre they seem to converge more and more
    until suddenly they jump apart like same-pole magnets, because at the
    centre Christianity is personal while Buddhism is impersonal.
    Christianity involves an I-Thou relationship with a personal God. For
    Buddhism there ios nobody home, the human person does not exist, and
    nor does a personal God.


    --
    Steve Hayes
    http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
    http://khanya.wordpress.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From David Dalton@1:229/2 to Steve Hayes on Tuesday, August 06, 2019 03:57:57
    XPost: soc.history, alt.religion.buddhism, alt.religion.christianity
    XPost: alt.religion
    From: dalton@nfld.com

    On Aug 6, 2019, Steve Hayes wrote
    (in article<ji4ikep55o92bv9vj1g7qjt0bnrhphbqkr@4ax.com>):

    On Mon, 05 Aug 2019 21:10:50 GMT, alt.fan.jai-maharaj@googlegroups.com
    (Dr. Jai Maharaj) wrote:

    That there are startling coincidences between Buddhism and
    Christianity cannot be denied, and it must likewise be
    admitted that Buddhism existed at least 400 years before
    Christianity. I go even further, and should feel extremely
    grateful if anybody would point out to me the historical
    channels through which Buddhism had influenced early
    Christianity.

    There are indeed similarities between Buddhism and Christianity,
    though they tend to be superficial.

    As you get closer to the centre they seem to converge more and more
    until suddenly they jump apart like same-pole magnets, because at the
    centre Christianity is personal while Buddhism is impersonal.
    Christianity involves an I-Thou relationship with a personal God. For Buddhism there ios nobody home, the human person does not exist, and
    nor does a personal God.

    You, or someone you are following up on, put a period instead of
    comma in between soc.history and alt.religion.buddhism , but
    I have corrected that in this followup.

    --
    David Dalton dalton@nfld.com http://www.nfld.com/~dalton (home page) http://www.nfld.com/~dalton/dtales.html Salmon on the Thorns (mystic page) “And don’t you know that there’s a wolf stalking in sheep’s
    clothing tells me he’s the real thing/Think what your life would be missing/if you didn’t have him to sing/To sing about” (S. McLachlan)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)