• Re: US military flexes muscles in message to Russia

    From slider@1:229/2 to All on Saturday, December 08, 2018 00:35:30
    From: slider@atashram.com

    same shit different month.

    ### - a tightening of the screw as russia is increasingly surrounded +
    tensions raised...

    at what point russia decides enough is enough though is anyone's guess,
    even the slightest infringement (such as this business in the black sea) indicating their willingness to act, and because if they'd let that one
    pass there'd have been another one so they're saying the buck stops there:
    that 'anything' crossing that line gets attacked!

    just can't see the west letting it go at that is all?

    so either ukraine (the west's cats-paw in all this) makes another stupid
    move (feigns left etc) drawing another response, either there or along
    their border whatever, or worse; a similar nato incursion of some
    description brings nato & russia into direct conflict... although can't
    imagine we're that stupid, so more likely ukraine then makes another move trying to draw nato into it...

    the 'risk' being russia taking/annexing ukraine to obviate the growing
    problem, and then what would we do! would we really go to war with russia
    to save/back-up poxy ukraine?? probably not! in which case then we'd have handed ukraine back to them and our growing influence in the area
    diminished! and we definitely wouldn't like that! that 'whatever' it is
    that we're up to there, it obviously isn't about establishing stalemates, borders and/or peace!

    iow: the next serious 'incident' there could well be telling!

    (there's not much wriggle-room left see? plus minor pieces on the board
    just got taken!)

    ***

    here's a suggestion for world peace: boot plonkershenco out and just
    'give' ukraine back to russia! just hand it over to them!

    that would certainly surprise 'em wouldn't it lol :)

    russia would maybe then reciprocate somewhere else in the world and
    tensions relaxed even more?

    talks could then begin to do more along those same lines everywhere else, including all the big players, and an era of sharing & reason ushered
    in... the money saved on building and maintaining arms and armies used to actively save the planet from ruin instead of destroying it!

    plus just imagine then how those all those soldiers of the world (all
    already highly organised/trained peeps) could, for example, set to work systematically scrubbing he oceans of all that plastic before moving onto
    other such equally needed work? global armies organised like that could
    achieve almost anything!

    like why can't we do something - more intelligent - like that instead??

    or is humanity too small-minded to ever be (or think) that... big!

    you may say am a dreamer
    but am not the only one ;)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From slider@1:229/2 to All on Friday, December 07, 2018 20:18:41
    From: slider@atashram.com

    Washington (CNN)The US military responded this week to what it calls
    Russia's "unlawful and destabilizing actions" in Ukraine and elsewhere by pushing back against Moscow on the seas and in the air.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/06/politics/us-russia-military-maneuvers/index.html

    In the second US military operation in as many days, a US Air Force OC-135 observation aircraft conducted an "extraordinary flight" Thursday under
    the Open Skies Treaty "to reaffirm US commitment to Ukraine," the Pentagon said.

    The flight came the day after the US Navy had sailed the guided missile destroyer USS McCampbell near the Peter the Great Bay in the Sea of Japan,
    a move that irked Russia, which maintains a territorial claim on the
    disputed waters that is not acknowledged by the US.

    'A pattern'

    Also on Wednesday, CNN reported that the US has begun making the necessary preparations to sail a warship into the Black Sea as a possible response
    to Russia's seizure of Ukrainian ships and sailors following a clash in
    the Kerch Strait.

    The Pentagon is "signaling a counter to the latest series of Russian
    actions and provocations that ramped up tensions in the region yet again," Peter Singer, a strategist and senior fellow at the think tank New
    America, told CNN.

    "Russia's unprovoked attack on Ukrainian naval vessels in the Black Sea
    near the Kerch Strait is a dangerous escalation in a pattern of
    increasingly provocative and threatening activity," Pentagon spokesperson
    Eric Pahon told CNN on Thursday.

    "The United States seeks a better relationship with Russia, but this
    cannot happen while its unlawful and destabilizing actions continue in
    Ukraine and elsewhere," he said.

    The military's robust response to Russia in recent days underscores the
    silence from President Donald Trump when it comes to criticizing Russian aggression, Singer noted, pointing to the clash in the Kerch Strait as a
    recent example.

    "What is fascinating is the utter disconnect between what the Pentagon is trying to communicate to Russia and the silence of the President," he said.

    But while Trump has appeared reluctant to initiate the full range of
    sanctions and diplomatic options at his disposal to counter Russia, the administration may be using the military as a way to apply pressure until officials determine they have struck the right balance, according to Boris Zilberman, a Russia expert at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies.

    "The US Navy is right to conduct these freedom of navigation operations
    and should continue to do so," Zilberman said.

    Russia continues its push to militarize waters near the Sea of Japan and
    has been trying to project an increased role in the Pacific, according to Zilberman. He said the latest US operation in the Sea of Japan may
    indicate increasing US concern about Russia's posturing in the Pacific.

    Line in the sand

    The Pentagon is likely trying to draw a line in the sand early on to
    prevent further escalation in the region, he said.

    "Russia must know that the US will not allow them to militarize
    international waterways in key areas such as the Black Sea, the Sea of
    Japan or Okhotsk, or elsewhere," Zilberman said. If not, he added, "it
    should be clear by now that when (Russian President Vladimir) Putin is not confronted, he will continue to act aggressively against the interests of
    the United States and our allies."

    A US Navy official told CNN that the USS McCampbell's passage through the disputed waters was the first time the US has conducted a freedom of
    navigation operation in that area since 1987, when the Soviet Union was
    the government making those claims.

    Amid the flurry of Russian and US activity, the President has been
    relatively quiet.

    As world leaders denounced Russia's aggression against Ukraine ahead of
    the G20 summit, Trump waited more than a day before offering a muted
    response, leaving the task of criticizing Moscow to the outgoing US
    ambassador to the UN.

    When asked how he felt about the clash, Trump said, "Not good. Not happy
    about it at all." He seemed reluctant to blame Russia, adding, "We do not
    like what's happening either way. And hopefully it will get straightened
    out."

    Ultimately, however, Russia's actions and its detention of Ukrainian
    sailors prompted Trump to cancel a planned meeting with Putin during the
    G20 summit.

    "Based on the fact that the ships and sailors have not been returned to
    Ukraine from Russia, I have decided it would be best for all parties
    concerned to cancel my previously scheduled meeting in Argentina with
    President Vladimir Putin," Trump tweeted from Air Force One en route to Argentina.
    Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, speaking at a NATO conference in Brussels, Belgium, on Tuesday, said the alliance "will collectively develop a set of responses that demonstrate to Russians this behavior is unacceptable."

    Unlike Trump, Defense Secretary James Mattis has consistently made his
    views on Russia's intentions known and has repeatedly warned that Putin
    aims to undermine NATO and the US itself.

    He was also unequivocal in his response to Russia's seizure of three
    Ukrainian vessels, calling it a "a flagrant violation of international
    law" and saying "it just shows that Russia cannot be counted on right now
    to keep its word."

    ### - so then, maybe not so much just plonkershenco himself, posturing/grandstanding his upcoming election in a bid to gain votes by deliberately taunting the russians via blatant incursions, so much as a
    set-up move, by the west, to justify now bringing US vessels into the
    area? something that's no doubt bound to be viewed as provocative by the rouskies, forcing some kind of response from them...

    white pawn to knight-4

    black to play...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From crickett@1:229/2 to All on Friday, December 07, 2018 12:34:55
    From: crsds@sbcglobal.net

    same shit different month.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From slider@1:229/2 to All on Saturday, December 08, 2018 07:18:31
    From: slider@atashram.com

    is it now or is it never ?

    ### - somewhere in-between :)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From crickett@1:229/2 to All on Friday, December 07, 2018 22:07:29
    From: crsds@sbcglobal.net

    you may say am a dreamer
    but am not the only one ;)

    is it now or is it never ?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From thang ornerythinchus@1:229/2 to All on Tuesday, December 11, 2018 13:54:31
    From: thangolossus@gmail.com

    Welcher, your traitorous taste for things Russian is well known here
    but in your ignorance of history and conflicts over the last 100
    years, I would really recommend to you that you do not directly attack
    Ukraine or its leaders. While nothing can be done about your slavish
    worship of Putin and his cronies, you do realise don't you that it
    makes no sense for you to attack Ukraine which is ostensibly an ally
    of the UK and the free west - because, as they say, the Emperor has no
    clothes :)

    Do you understand?

    I'll get around to providing you with my bitcoin wallet soon, so you
    can amble off to one of London's altcoin ATM's and make a deposit. You
    know, that 50 bucks you owe me, that legally enforcable debt...



    On Fri, 07 Dec 2018 19:18:41 -0000, slider <slider@atashram.com>
    wrote:

    Washington (CNN)The US military responded this week to what it calls
    Russia's "unlawful and destabilizing actions" in Ukraine and elsewhere by >pushing back against Moscow on the seas and in the air.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/06/politics/us-russia-military-maneuvers/index.html

    In the second US military operation in as many days, a US Air Force OC-135 >observation aircraft conducted an "extraordinary flight" Thursday under
    the Open Skies Treaty "to reaffirm US commitment to Ukraine," the Pentagon >said.

    The flight came the day after the US Navy had sailed the guided missile >destroyer USS McCampbell near the Peter the Great Bay in the Sea of Japan,
    a move that irked Russia, which maintains a territorial claim on the
    disputed waters that is not acknowledged by the US.

    'A pattern'

    Also on Wednesday, CNN reported that the US has begun making the necessary >preparations to sail a warship into the Black Sea as a possible response
    to Russia's seizure of Ukrainian ships and sailors following a clash in
    the Kerch Strait.

    The Pentagon is "signaling a counter to the latest series of Russian
    actions and provocations that ramped up tensions in the region yet again," >Peter Singer, a strategist and senior fellow at the think tank New
    America, told CNN.

    "Russia's unprovoked attack on Ukrainian naval vessels in the Black Sea
    near the Kerch Strait is a dangerous escalation in a pattern of
    increasingly provocative and threatening activity," Pentagon spokesperson >Eric Pahon told CNN on Thursday.

    "The United States seeks a better relationship with Russia, but this
    cannot happen while its unlawful and destabilizing actions continue in >Ukraine and elsewhere," he said.

    The military's robust response to Russia in recent days underscores the >silence from President Donald Trump when it comes to criticizing Russian >aggression, Singer noted, pointing to the clash in the Kerch Strait as a >recent example.

    "What is fascinating is the utter disconnect between what the Pentagon is >trying to communicate to Russia and the silence of the President," he said.

    But while Trump has appeared reluctant to initiate the full range of >sanctions and diplomatic options at his disposal to counter Russia, the >administration may be using the military as a way to apply pressure until >officials determine they have struck the right balance, according to Boris >Zilberman, a Russia expert at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies.

    "The US Navy is right to conduct these freedom of navigation operations
    and should continue to do so," Zilberman said.

    Russia continues its push to militarize waters near the Sea of Japan and
    has been trying to project an increased role in the Pacific, according to >Zilberman. He said the latest US operation in the Sea of Japan may
    indicate increasing US concern about Russia's posturing in the Pacific.

    Line in the sand

    The Pentagon is likely trying to draw a line in the sand early on to
    prevent further escalation in the region, he said.

    "Russia must know that the US will not allow them to militarize
    international waterways in key areas such as the Black Sea, the Sea of
    Japan or Okhotsk, or elsewhere," Zilberman said. If not, he added, "it
    should be clear by now that when (Russian President Vladimir) Putin is not >confronted, he will continue to act aggressively against the interests of
    the United States and our allies."

    A US Navy official told CNN that the USS McCampbell's passage through the >disputed waters was the first time the US has conducted a freedom of >navigation operation in that area since 1987, when the Soviet Union was
    the government making those claims.

    Amid the flurry of Russian and US activity, the President has been
    relatively quiet.

    As world leaders denounced Russia's aggression against Ukraine ahead of
    the G20 summit, Trump waited more than a day before offering a muted >response, leaving the task of criticizing Moscow to the outgoing US >ambassador to the UN.

    When asked how he felt about the clash, Trump said, "Not good. Not happy >about it at all." He seemed reluctant to blame Russia, adding, "We do not >like what's happening either way. And hopefully it will get straightened >out."

    Ultimately, however, Russia's actions and its detention of Ukrainian
    sailors prompted Trump to cancel a planned meeting with Putin during the
    G20 summit.

    "Based on the fact that the ships and sailors have not been returned to >Ukraine from Russia, I have decided it would be best for all parties >concerned to cancel my previously scheduled meeting in Argentina with >President Vladimir Putin," Trump tweeted from Air Force One en route to >Argentina.
    Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, speaking at a NATO conference in Brussels, >Belgium, on Tuesday, said the alliance "will collectively develop a set of >responses that demonstrate to Russians this behavior is unacceptable."

    Unlike Trump, Defense Secretary James Mattis has consistently made his
    views on Russia's intentions known and has repeatedly warned that Putin
    aims to undermine NATO and the US itself.

    He was also unequivocal in his response to Russia's seizure of three >Ukrainian vessels, calling it a "a flagrant violation of international
    law" and saying "it just shows that Russia cannot be counted on right now
    to keep its word."

    ### - so then, maybe not so much just plonkershenco himself, >posturing/grandstanding his upcoming election in a bid to gain votes by >deliberately taunting the russians via blatant incursions, so much as a >set-up move, by the west, to justify now bringing US vessels into the
    area? something that's no doubt bound to be viewed as provocative by the >rouskies, forcing some kind of response from them...

    white pawn to knight-4

    black to play...

    ---
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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)